Thuyen Vo S10

Thuyen: [00:00:00] since the lockdown lifts, everybody gets back to normal. And that is why I, I didn’t have a chance to, work with Best Ever Food Review Show ever again

Thuyen: I still run Easy English and Easy Vietnamese. I also spent the last year focusing on content creating on my old channel. on Instagram.

I started making a lot of reels on Instagram and it picked up. I think is quite tricky because.

You have to put yourself out there all the time, I feel I choose a niche. that I want to go into the fine dining segment

we are so famous for street food.

And if you look at, content creating for street food is like way too many and I cannot compete with that.

Niall: Vietnam is famous street food and it’s so competitive

 The food has changed dramatically

we just had the Michelin Guide

Thuyen: come to Vietnam for the first [00:01:00] time what difference did that make to the scene?

Welcome to Season 10: A Journey Through Vietnam with Niall Mackay

Niall: Welcome to another episode of a Vietnam podcast This is season 10 where I am interviewing past guests who have joined me throughout previous seasons My name is Niall Mackay and I first came to Vietnam in 2015 for a holiday I went back to New Zealand where I lived at the time and my wife and I just couldn’t stop eating Vietnamese food Vietnamese coffee even Ba Ba uh which is one of the worst beers you can get fell in love with the place decided to come back came back for about six weeks and eight years later we’re still here So there’s something about Vietnam that keeps us here My guest today was on season six back in 2021 [00:02:00] She’s been a host on the Best Ever Food Review Show which is one of the biggest channels on YouTube She has her own English and Vietnamese language centers And she was on

season six way back in 2021 when we were smack dab in the middle of a lockdown pandemic We met online on Zoom and we’ve never met

before until today So my guest today is Toin Vo

Thuyen: Wow. Great introduction. Thank you for having me.

So Best Ever Food Review Show is a food review channel. I think it’s like one of the biggest food reviews channels on, on YouTube. And I feel incredibly lucky to, to get involved.

So, me and Sonny, the channel owner, we have mutual friends, and then one day, the friend just kind of text me and say, Um, my friend is looking for somebody who can eat and then react, like, do you want to get involved? I’m like, okay, sounds fun.

Sonny actually gave me [00:03:00] my old segment called the 10 dining dollar, a 10 dollar dining, and he gave me 10 dollars and I have to figure out three meals for the day.

Music: Yeah,

Thuyen: and I hosted that alone.

Yeah. So it’s a really, really cool, cool thing to, to do.

Niall: That would be so easy. Breakfast, com tam, lunch, com tam, dinner, com tam. Done. Less than a hundred thousand dong. I’ll have that for breakfast, lunch, and dinner. Thank you for coming back and a big part of the last episode which we won’t get into was how terrible my Vietnamese is I think I’ll listen to it again We spent about the first five minutes discussing how to say your name but I think I’m I’m a bit better now No

Thuyen: that sounds really good

Niall: more of that then

Catching Up Post-Pandemic: Life Changes and Content Creation

Niall: No more of that Nailed it I’ll take that I’ll accept that It’s finally so good to meet you in person I’ve seen so much about the Best Ever Food Review Show It’s just gone from strength to strength Um we talked in the last episode how you got into that but what’s happening in general [00:04:00] with you now since we last spoke in 2021 which is only three years ago but it’s It seems like a lifetime ago because of the pandemic

Thuyen: It is like, I barely remember what happened since. Um, yeah, but, uh, since the lockdown lifts, everybody gets back to normal. And that is why I, I didn’t have a chance to work with best ever Food review Show ever again

Niall: Oh no because

Thuyen: he’d been traveling the world and yeah, I hope that he comes back and then I get to be on it again.

Um, yeah, but I still run the center. I still run Easy English and Easy Vietnamese. And, I also spent the last year focusing on content creating on my old channel. Uh, on Instagram.

Niall: did miss something out from my introduction actually that I meant to say Something really really important that I don’t think you would know this So I’m not big on YouTube I’m a podcaster I do audio podcasting But when we were in lockdown we could obviously record over Zoom [00:05:00] which as I said I listen back and the audio quality was absolutely terrible because Zoom is a terrible platform for that But we recorded ourselves and I put it on YouTube And I’ll be honest I leveraged on your experience in the Best Ever Food Review Show So I put in the title Oh let me go back a step Actually you can see what people search for and I’ve never told you this one either or maybe I did tell you by message I’m not sure but the number one search term for my website how people found my website was Sonny’s Wife Twinvaugh

Thuyen: Oh my god.

Niall: So many people Sonny’s wife question mark is Twinvaugh Sonny’s wife

the internet thought that you were Sonny’s wife or they wanted to know

Thuyen: you did the

Niall: or they put Best of a Food Review Show Twinvaugh So I leveraged that and put in the title of YouTube video Twinvaugh from Best of a Food Review Show which I didn’t in the beginning but

Thank you everyone

Well because I did that I don’t know how the YouTube algorithm works but I think what happened was [00:06:00] when somebody watched you on the Best Ever Food Review show they would maybe come up at the end like do you want to watch this And I think for a short time It came up my video So it went through the roof It’s the most watched video I’ve ever had on YouTube And I looked at it last week and it said something like This video has been watched 1073 times This is 1000 times more than normal

Thuyen: We should celebrate.

Niall: So thank you very much It’s it’s quite funny Um I think I only have like 120 subscribers and if you look at the data half of them came from that video because they were watching Probably to find out if you were Sonny’s wife

Thuyen: that video because

Niall: Let’s make it clear right now We’ll clear that up right now You are not

Sonny’s wife

Thuyen: find out if you were Sonny’s wife. You need to clear that up right now. [00:07:00] anyone that on the show, you know what I mean?

Like, because, um, they call it the editing

magic. And every time when somebody is on the show, it’s like great chemistry. So yeah, I maybe that’s

Niall: us now that you don’t have good chemistry with

Thuyen: chemistry with science.

No

Niall: just revealed it

Thuyen: revealed it. No, of course, yes. I mean, um, but still it’s work, you know. Yeah, and then, and then, yeah, it’s hard to film.

So, but then they make it very nice and you know, but it’s actually a lot of work. I mean, for the team. I just show up, but you know what I mean

Niall: I

do it

Thuyen: they make everything like look gray and smooth and easy, but, but it’s not

The Magic of Editing and the Challenges of Video Production

Niall: what’s some of the funny things that’s happened to you when you’ve been filming with the Best Ever Food Review Show

Thuyen: think the number one thing is, um, Like, I am not an expert on food at that time, and then [00:08:00] people solely watch me because how I react. Like, somehow it’s funny, and, um, he likes to do this thing where he didn’t tell me what we were going to shoot that day.

So I just show up and I’m like,

Niall: great

Thuyen: And, um, you know, I hate things when it’s really squirmy, you know, slimy kind of thing. And then we have this sea, I don’t know how you say that, it’s like a sea worm.

it looks

crazy. And then he was like, uh, do you want to come over here and touch it? And I’m like, maybe not.

So he put it on my, my hands and I hold it and oh my God, it was a craziest thing. Like I didn’t want to do that ever again. But yeah, like, like something like that. It happened quite often just because. they want to get

Niall: a

me He’s just setting you up to get

Thuyen: Yeah, yeah, which I like, you know, because I’m not, uh, I don’t do well with like too [00:09:00] scripted, like stage kind of thing.

And for this show, definitely like nothing like that. Like don’t even, they don’t even tell you what you’re going to shoot. So, you know, no, no stage.

Niall: I do remember I think it was you I think I messaged you about this You were I think it was in Vung Tau and you talked about going to the beach

But English obviously isn’t your first language

Thuyen: Oh, the bitch!

Niall: beach Yes you you remember it

Thuyen: god, that was embarrassing.

Niall: Do

Thuyen: to people listening what I’m referencing, if they

guess already?

Niall: And now you’re banned from Vung

Thuyen: know your family’s name? Like you said, right? English is not my first language.

And, um,

I saw a few bad laughing at you like I don’t mean to

no, no, but [00:10:00] okay. I mean, yeah, people did comment a lot about that and yeah, he, he like emphasized that in the editing,

Niall: I want to hear more about your doing content creation said you’re now doing you’re excited to be on the podcast because you’re looking at maybe doing your own podcast getting into your own content creation for food Tell us more about that

Thuyen: I think it takes a lot more because I’m so used to doing just vertical, like a story kind of thing.

Niall: And

Thuyen: And that’s why I thought to myself that TikTok and Instagram is easier because you’re not as shorter and it’s faster.

Like you don’t have to make like the whole production, like 15 minutes. So I started making a lot of reels on Instagram and it picked up. Like. I got a lot of views, a lot of comments, a lot of followers, and I think I started to get into it because, you know, I’m the type of person I need to see results.

Like, I cannot [00:11:00] go years and years and years. And Sonny told me this story about how he started and it takes years.

Niall: I’ve seen his first video and it is an inspiration

some of my I mean this what we’re doing right now is

Thuyen: Right

Niall: than what I’ve done before and his first ever video it was like grainy oh black and white oh no it wasn’t black and white but it was like you know it was poor quality and see it now and he’s got one of the best channels

Exactly. But you want to go straight to the top

Thuyen: No, like yeah, I am a millennial. Yeah, like I’m impatient, you know, so yeah, but then I make reels and I, I figure I really like doing that. And then last year I have some opportunities, you know, to get into a lot of, uh, You know, um, how do you say that? Like unique kind of dining experiences. And that is why I was so excited to, you know, edit the videos because usually I was not, it takes a lot of time.

And, [00:12:00] um, and yeah, that, that’s what happened. So things started picking up and then I got to work with different brands. Um, I step up, I spend more time on content creating and, you know, they call it like the food business. F& B Influencer, kind of thing, which I don’t know,

Niall: I,

still cannot

Thuyen: still cannot accept it. Well, yes, I hope so, you know, because, um, people watch you that’s real, and they do follow, um, in the sense of like, they want recommendations, and, like, I’m the same.

If I go to a restaurant now, I would not just go. That’s crazy. In 2024, like you, you have to read reviews and you have to go online, you know, see how it looks like. Right. See the food, see the

Niall: Just saying to me like right no I do not need to do that But my wife does

And I friends that I remember we were out we were in Bali somewhere and she was like hold on let me find out what’s the best dish to order And I was like what do you mean She’s like I’ll just look up all the reviews And I I would never [00:13:00] do that in a million years I don’t wanna know the menu I wanna show up get given a menu look at it It’s gonna be the same five things as every other menu It’s gonna be a burger a pasta a pizza something I

deserve it,

I Like you would figure out

something

Thuyen: like you will figure out some hidden terms like that, right? Like, like, yeah, I agree. But. Like, I’m so anxious, so I have to do my search, right? And, and yeah, I slowly accept the title, you know, because I feel like if I get the title and I owe it, and then I started working, Like as an influencer, then I’d be okay with it.

Like if I don’t accept that, and then I would be like, so what am I, you know, like, like I’m not even proud of my own work, then, then that’s not great. So yeah, so I accepted that. I put it on my LinkedIn, you know, and then, and then it’s, it’s became something.

Niall: You mentioned you’re a millennial You almost look [00:14:00] too young to be a millennial I’m an elder millennial I’ve found out which is bizarre

Thuyen: millennial. What do you mean an elder,

Niall: I’m on like the cusp so like I’m born in 82 like I’m just a millennial look a lot younger than me But it’s funny because I don’t know there’s a American right wing talk show woman person I don’t even know what she is her name’s Tammy Lahren This was years ago she was on the Trevor Noah show like the Daily Show with Trevor Noah and she went well you know I’m a millennial so I don’t like labels And he’s like you just labeled yourself

there like

yeah and I didn’t realize that’s a millennial trait that they love to label themselves

Thuyen: Oh, maybe.

Niall: you’ve just done it You’re like I need a label

I

Thuyen: I mean, you, you kind of have, Oh, I know what you mean now. Yeah, I think so. I think Gen Z, they, they prefer a little more freedom. But as a millennial, we need labels to navigate our life. Because what am I if I’m not an [00:15:00] influencer?

Niall: When did this start though that we needed to name the generations Because I remember five ten years ago I barely even knew I was a millennial I didn’t know what a Gen Z was until about six months ago Before we were all just people and now suddenly it’s like Oh I’m like I hear Gen Zers They’re proud to be like Oh you know I’m

Thuyen: Boomers

Niall: are not proud to be called boomers That’s like an insult If you’re like okay boomer And then as millennials are like In the middle somewhere

Thuyen: no, I think, I think the word has been changing like drastically. Don’t, don’t you agree? Like, I feel like now people started to have some time, like downtime and then really sit down and think about thing. That’s why the term healings, like really rising. And, and I think so.

I think,

Niall: I don’t

Thuyen: know, again, I want to label it so I can, I know who people, like, where they are, you know? Have you ever heard of a millennial pause? a millennial pause?

Okay, so, [00:16:00] oh my god, I don’t know why I’m getting into this, but a millennial, usually when you film a video, you will press record, and then you pause, and then you talk.

You don’t, do you know that? Oh my god. And then the Zenzi, they would just start talking. They don’t pause. Yeah, that’s the thing like, oh my God, I spent way too much time on TikTok

Niall: so I don’t know Yeah yeah

Thuyen: I’m not a Gen Z, so

Niall: Gen Z

Thuyen: pause

Yeah. Yeah. Like my, my TikTok is like millennial content.

Niall: is gonna change your life and so my wife who’s also an elder millennial is all about the Gen Z selfie have your phone here right so you know how you take a selfie camera faces you so pick up your phone let’s we’ll do a selfie right take a selfie of yourself like a normal selfie

Thuyen: I would just do it with my camera facing me, you

Niall: yeah right

so apparently the Gen Z selfie is Turn do turn it around so it’s not on the selfie so it’s coming out the front [00:17:00] camera Now now put it on 0 5

Thuyen: 5.

Niall: turn it around and take the picture with the side button Which one of the side buttons takes the picture

No you closed it

That That was the wrong button See no but I do the same as well This is the try it again

the jet This is Gen Z It’s one of the volume buttons I think takes the picture

Thuyen: Oh yeah, I did. And that was awkward,

Niall: But that’s a Gen Z selfie And it’s way better because you put on 0

up way more And the camera is a higher quality than the selfie camera right

Thuyen: they figure it out.

They’ll figure

Niall: that out so I’ve taught you something new the Gen Z selfie So now when you do your TikToks and your videos and your selfies I want to see it I want to see the Gen Z

Selfie.

Thuyen: let’s confuse

Niall: how they do it Yeah there

You go

So what’s next then in terms of your content creation your food and beverage influence You mentioned that you’re friends with Joval who’s also been on the podcast during the pandemic well

Thuyen: great. Yeah. Um, you [00:18:00] know, I, uh, talking about content creating, I think is quite tricky because.

You have to put yourself out there all the time, I feel And that is why at first I was quite hesitant to, to do it. Like still now I’m not doing it full time. Like I’m still doing Easy English. Um, but I feel like it’s like now it’s the time, you know, you kind of have to jump on that train because my background is marketing and I can see how, how effective that is.

And, um, I start to have the perspective of both the business and then the consumer because I’ve been on both sides and that’s why I wanted to try to do it first and then I want to learn more about that. That’s why I want to kind of go to Europe next year and learn, I don’t know, about hospitality or something like that.

Um, I don’t know, but do you have this feeling when you, I’m okay, I’m [00:19:00] 29,

Niall: Oh she’s reviewed it She’s taught her zone Now

Thuyen: I’m fine with that. And I feel like I, um, I find like this new passion for learning because now I know exactly what I like. Um, like, you know, when I was like 18, I don’t know why people ask me to choose English. like a major in college.

I had no idea what I want to do. I didn’t do anything. I didn’t try anything. So, um, yeah, that’s why now I know what I want and I kind of want to, you know, gone on that path again, kind of learn in a school, you know, where I learned things properly. And at the same time, uh, kind of want to discover, you know, another country, for example.

Um, because I love traveling. Yeah. Then I still want to do that. Work with hotel, work with, you know, resort and also food and beverages. I, I choose a niche. [00:20:00] that I want to go into the fine dining segment because I feel like that is where, um, I kind of have a little more, um, you know, of the room to play around because I feel like in Vietnam, we are so famous for street food.

And if you look at, content creating for street food is like way too many and I cannot compete with that. Oh my god, I cannot even, you know, ride a motorcycle. You asked me today. I was like, yeah, I took a grab. Guilty. Um, yeah, so, so I kind of choose fire dining segment because I remember I filmed the episode with Sonny, uh, about fire dining and then At first, I told him like, I don’t like this.

Like, oh my god, we’re going to this restaurant, fancy restaurant. And we’re like, sit down. The portion is small. Um, but after we’re filming that, yeah. But, but you, you, you’d be surprised how full [00:21:00] you are after. Yeah, so like, so after those episodes, I changed my mind, you know. And one of the videos is about caviar, and it’s like, the highest view I ever had on the show.

And I figure it’s actually very, it’s, it’s an art, you know, like, cause I never look at food like that. Like I love food, but it was never like that. And then when I look into fine dining, I was like, gosh, like that was a whole new world. And last year I had a chance to, um, you know, um, have dinner in like some Michelin star restaurants.

My first time I had a three star in Singapore. Oh my God, that was so crazy. And then a two star, and then a one star, right? So like, all of that is Come down to experiences. And I really want to, to share that with everyone because before I got into that, I didn’t know that it was a thing. You know, I would just eat food and then move on with my life.

Um,[00:22:00]

Niall: As

most of us do

Thuyen: Right? But then, yeah, it was, it was an art itself and, and I want to show that to people I think. I love education and I love, you know, content creating. So I feel that whenever I talk about food, it’s in a way it’s, it’s like education itself, because I’m talking about this knowledge of food and a lot of things that people misunderstand, especially in this day and age, like, you know, you have way too many information.

Like I feel the same way. And you kind of navigate, you kind of have to choose an influencer that fits you. You know that, right? Like, you don’t watch everyone.

Niall: influencer

Thuyen: God.

Niall: I understand what you

Thuyen: Yeah, like for example, fashion, right? I have to watch an influencer that has the same body type as me.

Niall: sense Yeah

Thuyen: So, it’s the same way. And, um, the trend is like, the opportunity is a lot because yeah, it’s competitive, but at the same time, [00:23:00] um, the market is also great. And then you can just cut a star, which I’m, I’m trying to do. Yeah.

Niall: But Vietnam is famous street food and it’s so competitive because any you can find anywhere in on YouTube it’s like I ate for 1 a day in Vietnam or blah blah blah People love to go on about it And it is one of the appealing things here Like I had boon cha today for lunch and it’s just so delicious and it costs like 2 3 right You know what I mean So you do think about it but this is something we talked a lot about this on this podcast I talk a lot about I talk about it a lot Vietnam Saigon especially I do this all the time where I say Vietnam but I actually mean Saigon because Saigon is completely different to the rest of Vietnam And most of Vietnam is still very rural You go out to the countryside I mean you drive an hour out of Saigon you’re in the countryside So Saigon especially I don’t know about Hanoi because I don’t go there I don’t live there I’ve been a couple of times but I don’t know about Hanoi but Saigon especially [00:24:00] has developed so much in the past eight years that I’ve been here like incredibly so And food is part of that I when and I don’t because I’m not part of the food and beverage team normally when I talk about the development of Saigon I talk about there’s a new bridge there’s a new tower there’s a new road because these are things that you can see and things that I use So I don’t think about the food so much but now you bring it up The food has changed dramatically When we first came here it was like I want to get a banh mi because it costs less than a dollar You know I want to get com tam because it costs a dollar But now the fine dining scene and what I want to ask you about to talk about

The Impact of the Michelin Guide on Vietnam’s Culinary Scene

Niall: which is so exciting we just had the Michelin Guide

Thuyen: come to Vietnam for the first time What a difference did that what difference did that make to the scene

there’s a lot of controversial, um, you know, about Michelin guy coming here.

Niall: Welcome to another episode of a Vietnam podcast This is season 10 where I am interviewing past guests who have joined me throughout previous seasons My name is Niall Mackay and I first came to Vietnam in 2015 for a holiday I went back to New Zealand where I lived at the time and my wife and I just couldn’t stop eating Vietnamese food Vietnamese coffee even Ba Ba uh which is one of the worst beers you can get fell in love with the place decided to come back came back for about six weeks and eight years later we’re still here So there’s something about Vietnam that keeps us here My guest today was on season six back in 2021 She’s been a host on the Best Ever Food [00:01:00] Review Show which is one of the biggest channels on YouTube She has her own English and Vietnamese language centers And she was on

season six way back in 2021 when we were smack dab in the middle of a lockdown pandemic We met online on Zoom and we’ve never met

before until today So my guest today is Toin Vo food has changed dramatically When we first came here it was like I want to get a banh mi because it costs less than a dollar You know I want to get com tam because it costs a dollar But now the fine dining scene and what I want to ask you about to talk about which is so exciting we just had the Michelin Guide

Thuyen: come to Vietnam for the first time what difference did that make to the scene

there’s a lot of controversial, um, you know, about Michelin guy coming here.

But

for me,

I look at it as an opportunity for Vietnam to attract more tourists. You know, like, people get really emotional [00:02:00] when, uh, when you talk about food because, you know, it’s like a memory, it’s like an experience, and everybody was fighting towards the list, like, Oh, why is this one is not good? And it was not.

Um, I feel like every list is. Like, it cannot be perfect, you know, and they have a very different, um, purpose when they make the list. So, um, Michelin guys, technically, from what I understand, is the guy that tourists come into a new country and they don’t know what they’re gonna get. So, for example, if you go to Vietnam for the first time, um, How do you know what pho is or what banh mi is?

Yeah, maybe you have it in your home country, but you know, still here. And then when it goes down to like bún you said, right? Like it’s, they, they don’t know. So the Michelin guide is technically showing you what you should try. Um, uh, for example, like the local food, and then they move on to something different, [00:03:00] like Thai dining or Thai food.

Cannot, don’t have to be fine dining, but can be like casual dining, right? And they have different, um, how do you say category? Because everybody was quite confused about Michelin guy, beef gourmet, you know, or one star, two star, three star. And they, they all put into, Oh, this, this is a Michelin, place.

Niall: I’d heard of that either

Michelin Guide which is

I don’t even know what the Beef Gourmand or

Thuyen: Yeah. The biv Gourmet. Yeah.

So

Niall: like the actual Michelin

Star Right.

which is

totally different one thing I read about as well was There’s no such thing as a Michelin star chef

Thuyen: No. Oh my God. happy

Niall: well yeah like it’s a Michelin star restaurant chef doesn’t take the star

Thuyen: No, but Yeah, but he can work there, right?

He

Niall: worked at a Michelin star

restaurant but not a Michelin

Thuyen: no, there, [00:04:00] there’s no such thing. Yeah, but, but I think, but I understand, right? Because when you do marketing, you kind of have to.

Niall: truth

Thuyen: like it’s it’s hard for you to write.

He used to work at like, yeah So they put it as short like yeah, the two Michelin I get that but I understand why some people when they Die deep into the FNB scene and they get a little you know, worked up and I get that too. Um, yeah, but I think, I think, yeah, I was really happy when, when they came here, you know, because like you said, Saigon developed so much and we never have a Michelin ever, ever.

Now they coming to Da Nang and yeah, yeah. So, So I was happy to see that, you know, and for me, the list is not permanent. Like, yeah, people will, you know, they will put in some new places, they will give star to the new one and yeah, they may take back the star. Like I, I saw that in Malaysia [00:05:00] before. Yeah. Like you may have this this year, but the next

year gonna.

Take it away from you. So yeah, so for me, I would just, you know, I want to see how it goes. And from the marketing perspective, that’s great for Vietnamese tourism. and there’s, but there’s a lot of misunderstanding about it as well. Like some people, they think about that. It’s like, oh, it’s always ph dining.

You know, like it’s always expensive, which is not the

Niall: That’s what I thought then I found out it’s part of being in the guide So not getting the star is mostly fine dining right

Thuyen: Being

Niall: on the guide one of the criteria is like value for money And one of my favorite places that I’ve come to since the beginning is near Bintan Market It’s called Bep Mee Inn

that was on that was added to the guide

for money and taste And so it’s quite funny because The food I don’t think is that great you can go and get street food for better But really good for what it is And it’s in a touristy area

But the only annoying thing is I’ve been back there a couple of times [00:06:00] since ’cause if someone comes to town I’ll I’ll normally take them there ’cause it’s central and it is it is good food

but it’s not cheap That’s the difference So like Come Town would maybe be 40,000

Thuyen: 000

Niall: food but it bit me and it’s like a hundred thousand but it’s cleaner and whatever blah blah blah But anyway the last twice I’ve been it is packed like lines out the

Exploring the Michelin Guide: A Foodie’s Perspective

Niall: door Yeah Since it got added to the Michelin

Thuyen: lines out of the door, since it got added to the Michelin Guide. I

don’t

Niall: I know where to get calm down while you go in

there

Thuyen: to get content while you’re going there.

Niall: it’s I

Thuyen: I think it’s great for tourists and for people who first come here. Um, you know, and then, yeah, like for example, I have one star at like an Just a casual dining place, but yeah, when you go to Bangkok, for example, I had a dinner at Element, One Star in Bangkok, and it’s fine dining. [00:07:00] So, it doesn’t have to be, I think One Star doesn’t have to be, but from two and three, it’s getting pricier, and yeah, the experience also elevated.

Um, But yeah, I think, I think for me, I also followed it when I travel, you know, in, um, for example, I went to Singapore and Malaysia for my birthday. And yeah, so I also followed it

The Michelin Guide Debate: Local vs. Fusion Cuisine

Thuyen: . What my tip is, if you want to try local food, maybe you shouldn’t follow it. Yeah, but if you want something fusion, I definitely think you should try on the Michelin Guide.

Because a lot of my friends, they come to me and they will like, Where is a good local food in Bangkok that has Michelin? I’m like, I don’t know. I don’t think you should. You know, cause like, you can, yeah, you can Google and you know, have a high rating

Niall: rating,

Thuyen: but like when it comes to local food, I don’t think you [00:08:00] should come to a, to a Michelin star place.

.

Elevating Vietnam’s Culinary Scene: A Shift Towards Fine Dining

Niall: you mentioned a little bit ago about um bringing more tourists

Vietnam What I think something like the Michelin Guide coming and the increase in the quality of the restaurants is it brings and this might sound bad but a better class of tourists I know from reading things that Vietnam is is well known for bringing tourists It’s got like the lowest spend I don’t know if you know this like tourists come to Vietnam and they don’t spend much money which you can see because obviously things are very cheap here but as well but they come and they don’t spend much money And I know that’s something that Vietnam government or the tourism are looking at How can we increase how much people spend Because it’s not just Vietnam people go to Thailand or Somewhere else in Southeast Asia and they will spend more money whereas they come to VA Vietnam and they’re barely spending anything So with more restaurants of a higher quality it’s I think it’s gonna help attract people come to Vietnam and that’s gonna take a long time because People come to Vietnam for the street food [00:09:00] Like you said you go on YouTube that’s all you’re going to find That’s all people think about And it makes sense because the food is absolutely delicious

But having more availability of nicer restaurants And I went from my 40 I’m 41 now when I went from my wife took me from my 40th I’m terrible with names I can’t remember the name but it was off Windway Walking Street and it was just incredible like a seven course meal I didn’t even know it existed and it’s like this is amazing

Thuyen: Monkey Gallery. I

Niall: think it was Monkey Gallery Yeah Really nice place yeah

Yeah.

Thuyen: I think so. Um, I think it’s a misconception as well, you know, because like when I work in this industry, there’s a lot of nice restaurants, like high end too. And like, I always tell my friends, because I don’t know, because I’m, I was born and raised here.

Um, so I don’t know how be like from outside looking in, but from what I see, there are so many nice places and not cheap. [00:10:00] Like it can be really expensive, like anywhere that I’ve been, you know, even Europe too. Like the, um, for example, if you go to like, um, I don’t know, three star, uh, Michelin, right. It’s usually like 400, 300 euros or something.

And here you can find that too. Like, it’s not cheaper. And I’m, and I’m saying that with confidence, like, like. I feel like it’s a misconception of Vietnam having like, uh, like you said, Saigon and Vietnam is like, yeah, very different, right?

i, I’m always really excited when they come and I show them this side of Saigon and I’d be like, Whoa, cause they don’t know Yeah. And then like you said, the street food is great, but yeah, why not open to, you know, new market, right? And then the thing is, I also find it really crazy when people complain that why this is Vietnamese food, but why is it so expensive?

It can be too. And yeah, like if you, If you watch, I don’t know, [00:11:00] but I watched the process of making some certain dishes in Vietnam, it’s complicated. Yeah, and, and, I don’t know why. We should all rise the standard together, you know, in a way. And I always tell my friend, yeah, you have to check that out because the scene is totally different.

And I can see in the future, you know, Saigon would be one of those. Yeah, culinary experiences. Yeah, up there with the guy. I hope so, because, you know, you see Bangkok, right? Oh, they’ve been there for a while. They’re great with tourism. I feel like Saigon is the first one to start and then Hanoi and then now Da Nang. And Da Nang is still new, right?

Niall: It’s moving in the right direction And interesting to seeing about the availability the price So my sister’s never come to Vietnam She was due to come and then she’s so selfish She got pregnant No I’m kidding So she had a she has a baby now which is amazing I’m so happy about that And so she couldn’t come And I think [00:12:00] Lindsay if you watch this I don’t think she does watch this I’ll listen to it But if she does you

Thuyen: hope

Niall: I don’t think she came for a while because Because of that perception that Vietnam is dirty chaotic dirty gonna get sick Some of those things are true

Some of them are somewhere in the middle But once I started to show like pictures of Oh by the way we’re in this really nice cocktail bar you know we’re in Layla or

wherever like, And they’re like

well one of my favorite things is you can do both You can go to the street and drink on the street like some plastic chairs and then walk around the corner and go to Layla You know it’s like that’s one of the things I love about it But once she started to see that there was like nice things here she did book a flight to come and she had to change it because she got pregnant So that’s not her But so I went to visit how she lives in Australia And you can’t get a coffee like a cappuccino for less than five dollars Australian And I thought that seemed really expensive and then I did the math and I was like well that’s about 85 000 dong That’s about the same as a cappuccino here[00:13:00]

Thuyen: Not even D1

Niall: just almost like so people say oh coffee’s so cheap in Vietnam And it can be and I love my cafe sua da and I’ll go in the morning fin coffee cafe sua da Cost 20 000 dong which is like a 1 10 Australian right So obviously that is available but if I want to go and get a cappuccino it’s gonna cost 50 all the way up to 80 90 thousand dong which then you’re like that’s the same price as Australia So the misc there is a bit of a misconception Vietnam can be cheap but it can also be on par with the rest of the world And the quality like some of the co I mean I like my coffee so I don’t want to go on too much but sometimes you get a cappuccino here and you’re like

Thuyen: like

Niall: incredible And as I said I was just in Australia I got a couple of cappuccinos there they were absolutely garbage like this is awful You know when you’ve paid five dollars for it I’m a bit of a coffee snob I am a coffee snob I’ll

Thuyen: yeah

I think so. I think the gap is definitely there, right? But yeah, I [00:14:00] think, I think that, that is why when, when it comes to traveling, um, I always tell people, like, you have to see the world. Oh, and I hate to use that word, but like the, the, the spending that you gonna, you’re gonna spend is, it’s gonna be really different experiences, you know, like, for example, if you stay in this place, and I’m not saying that it’s less or more, you know, but it’s just like, it’s a totally different experience when you come to certain places and, um, And it happened like almost anywhere in the world, you know, like I can go to this one place and then like, yeah, I went to Singapore when I was, you know, young and don’t have anything, don’t have a penny to my name.

And it’s different. And now I come back. It’s different. You know, so, so yeah, I think I think it’s the same thing in Vietnam. But the thing is, the perception of people from outside, they always see Vietnam at the You know, the street food, which is [00:15:00] okay, but yeah, I, I would like to just get a word out there and then saying, but yeah,

Niall: it’s

Thuyen: Saigon, you know, big city then yeah, you, you can come here and experience all types of

Niall: yeah you can come here and experience all types of things So we don’t need to mention them again I I know we’d recommend it It was unbelievable Three because I actually want to know myself because my wife asks me all the time where should we go to eat let’s go somewhere nice And do you know what I do I message Joval

Thuyen: I

Niall: I will send a text

She normally just says check my website because she updates her websites The last time I asked her she’s like yeah check my website And I was like yeah that

probably of all of Saigon messaging her every day Like where should I

Where

Thuyen: I’m

Niall: pretty sure. she’s sick of

you ask her too right See we all do it So everyone go message [00:16:00] JoVal Chan right now She’s the premier food blogger in

Thuyen: Shout out to you,

Niall: Yeah

Thuyen: But yeah,

yeah. Oh, that’s

Niall: But what’s your top three then

Thuyen: Oh my God, it’s so hard.

Top Dining Picks in Saigon: A Food Blogger’s Recommendations

Thuyen: Um, but I will, I will go to the one that I go often.

And I think the, the one that I go really often, it has to be Pizza at Fort P. And I’m sorry that it’s not Vietnamese

Yeah. Yeah, yeah. But, um, I think, oh, it’s so great, know, and then it just like, if I don’t know where to go, I go there. Yeah, like I, like, I know that I’m gonna get something good

Niall: Can I guess favourite dish

Because we go semi often as well with our friends and Kim and Kim’s Vietnamese as well and she gets the same thing every time and I’m going to guess you get the same thing The crab pasta

Thuyen: Oh, it used to be. Yeah, but now I’m more like a pastel person. Yeah, but, but I know [00:17:00] what you mean, right? And then, yeah, I, I think that’s one I would totally recommend just, you know, so you don’t have to think about where to go. Um, the second place that I go often because I live in D2, we live in D2, is, I don’t else to I love stalk

Niall: they’ll come and find us and

Thuyen: Oh yeah, for you

Niall: for you.

because they think that your son is wife

Thuyen: No, my God. Um,

yeah, I would totally go to the deck. Oh, I love place. Yeah, I, I, oh my God, you have to get a table, you know, right where the water is. And it’s just amazing. Like, yeah.

Niall: happy hour Because I’m a happy hour kind of guy

Thuyen: Oh my God. I’m sorry. I don’t drink.

Niall: at all. Oh I plan my drinking by happy hours

Thuyen: Smart.

Niall: the deck I’ve not been to the deck in

Thuyen: Yeah, like I go there really often just because you can go there to see the sunset.

Um, yeah. And then, you know, just do whatever. But yeah, you have to get close to the water,

Niall: please. [00:18:00] The

Thuyen: The last Oh my God. Can I rain check with you When do

Niall: you go often It doesn’t have to be your top three but what would

Thuyen: be

places

Niall: to it can be a street food place as well

In

Thuyen: Oh my god, but I got everything delivered.

Oh my god, I’m a terrible person. Oh, where do I go often in Vietnam? In Saigon, yeah?

Niall: Well you can do all of you

Thuyen: In Saigon. Okay, um, I like sushi. And I like omakase. Do you like

Niall: omakase?

Remind me what’s omakase

again

Thuyen: It’s technically just, just, no, just like courses. Like, you don’t,

Niall: like a izakaya Um no

it’s

Thuyen: no, it’s because it’s more like drinking food. But omakase is technically like, you don’t order, like, you, you have a set menu already.

Niall: No I’ve not been I don’t eat much sea I eat

Thuyen: Oh, that’s why.

Niall: And I drink so I go to izakayas and get

Thuyen: it’s a there. [00:19:00] Yeah. Um, yeah. But for Omakase, I usually just go to Kyoto. Um, uh, it’s really close to City Garden. And, uh, the reason why I like it, because it’s quite casual. It’s good for the price range. Yeah, and I think a lot of people in Saigon, they know about that one.

Yeah, but You know when it comes to and that is another episode About omakase. Yeah, because it’s really overused nowadays everybody doing like omakase course menu for sushi for Um, yeah, but I would choose Kyoto because it’s like very, like, if you go there, you know that you’re going to get something nice and good price, affordable.

Niall: So just to review your top three places in Saigon Vietnam was a Japanese pasta and pizza place or

p

was a Western cocktail bar And a Japanese That’s your top three places in Saigon

Thuyen: [00:20:00] yeah, and, and, and I have a reason for that. Um, Vietnamese food, yeah, like you said, right, I love street food as well, but yeah, my stomach is not the strongest. And the second thing is, I usually get them delivered, because it’s so hot out

Niall: It’s really hot right

Thuyen: mean? Yeah. So, yeah, if it’s about Vietnamese food, I Vietnamese foods

Bún Riêu.

Niall: Um reo I don’t like it fishy

Thuyen: but I like that in Ch Bánh

Thành. Yeah, I think that that is my favorite one. I only eat Bún Riêu in that one. Never go anywhere else. Um, I’m not, oh, I’m basic. I like pho.

Niall: See I don’t

like yeah

don’t

Thuyen: God. And, and, a lot of people are going to shout at me for this, but I like pasta, pho hoa pasta.

Uh, it’s on Pasta Street. Yeah, and it’s called pho hoa. It’s

Niall: Oh Pho Hua Pasteur

Thuyen: Yeah,

Niall: Sorry

I thought you said Pho Hua [00:21:00] Pasta

Thuyen: No, no, no, no, No, pasta. Yeah, my

Niall: No no it’s

Thuyen: Yeah, yeah, yeah, but that, uh, yeah, and it’s very touristy, but I’m

I love

it.

Niall: love

Thuyen: I sent everyone there. And yeah, a lot of people want to yell at me for that too.

And, um, I think the last one I have to say, uh, from my hometown. Yeah. So it’s, uh, Ban Sao, but it’s not the one here. Um, small. Yeah. Like, um, from the center version.

Niall: before

Thuyen: like, not, not that too crispy, small, but a little soft and Oh my God. It just, it’s just great.

Niall: We’re going to go eat that then sometime because let’s let’s meet up So uh I used to live in Fun Yen and at Fun Yen market behind my house there was a woman on the street back there that sold exactly what you’re talking talking about the mini Banh And I had a guest on the show Tam Le and she used to do food as well Do you remember She used to do Saigon [00:22:00] Saigonista She did like fusion between Mexican and Vietnamese food Do you remember

Thuyen: No

Niall: She left about five years ago I think Well she came to when I first started I lived in Funyan and I just had one microphone and we did the recording and afterwards we we went to have the mini Banh Xeo and she could speak a little bit of Vietnamese She was American but she could speak Vietnamese and she talked to them and she’s like Oh yeah they’re from Nha

a central version

And I don’t know if they’re still there but you know things in Vietnam never some things change quickly and some things never change And I hope it’s still there So if it is let’s go

And it’s

so delicious That my Sunday morning

Thuyen: Oh, that’s great. Because, because when I moved here, I moved here when I was 15. And yeah, I struggled a lot because the food was quite different.

But

now

I think my taste buds change as well, like a little

here.

Yeah. Um, yeah, but again, like food is very subjective, you know, and, and I believe that you will have a good [00:23:00] experience here, but somebody, you know, gonna have a really crappy one and then the next day the same. So yeah, I think, I think that’s why I’m so happy.

The Personal Side of Food: Reflections and Future Aspirations

Thuyen: I’m so intrigued, you know, by food, just because it’s very personal, yeah, and I think you agree with me, right, that it’s a very personal experience, and you will find your people share the same love for that place, yeah, and it’s a lot of memory, you know, and an art itself, yeah, like some people do it for three different generations, yeah, so that’s why I love food.

Niall: it for three different generations So that’s why I love food Vietnamese guy called Daniel in the first season and as well that was one of the questions was what’s your favorite Vietnamese food and he was just like calm down like [00:24:00] could literally it all day every day and at that time I don’t think I really had it So I didn’t really get it and now I get it

Thuyen: yeah, I, I had the chance to introduce it to the U. S. Ambassador. Yeah, yeah. And it was so amazing because he totally ate it, you know, because when you film shows, sometimes people don’t really eat.

And it was like, May 9:00 AM in the morning and he went in with a pistol and everything and with Ture. Yeah, he did great. And yeah, that’s why I think fruit really brought people together. You know? He, oh, he went at it .

Niall: it up

This is I’ve been having this discussion lately with a couple of people One of the things that fascinates me about Vietnamese food right is in the West we have breakfast lunch and dinner food So breakfast is like cereal or yoghurt pancakes if you’re American Lunch would be like a sandwich or a salad maybe Dinner would be pasta or a pizza [00:25:00] or meat and veg something that We are very different meals for each meal like you’d be looked at insane if you had pancakes for dinner

But in Vietnam it doesn’t matter what meal it is you can eat the same dish like there’s a Mee Kwang place across from me packed to breakfast packed at lunch packed to dinner I’ve eaten it for all three meals com tam I’ve had it 10 in the morning I’ve had it for lunch and I’ve had it for dinner.

Thuyen: It’s

Niall: just it’s one of the things I love about Vietnamese food it’s not it’s not set to one meal you can eat it whenever you want

Thuyen: Yeah, and I think we, the challenge is, I don’t know about other Vietnamese, but I need like one meal. I don’t, I don’t understand the cereal

concept.

Niall: an interesting I never thought about that the

Thuyen: I, I

Niall: here

Thuyen: Exactly. People would it and sweat and it’s great. Like nobody complains.

Niall: see somebody with like a steaming bowl of hot soup and I’m like

Thuyen: Yeah, we that, and, and we need that three meals a day. [00:26:00] And yeah, some people will disagree, but I

Niall: don’t have cold food though I never

thought about that there’s No,

Thuyen: no, like, for example, like, banh mi, you know, like, yeah, some people have it for breakfast because it’s fast, but yeah, like, I, I’m a soup person.

So yeah, I like

anything

Yeah, it’s right. I don’t know, but yeah, like, like I need warm meals all the time and oh my God, it sounds like a lot of work, but yeah. I, I cannot do it like cereal sandwich.

I would die. Yeah.

Well

Niall: I’m hungry now I know this often happens when the V M podcast we get talking about either food or beer and I’m ready for a beer I’m ready for food I’m hungry now Thank you so much for coming on again I can’t believe it’s been three years since we first talked Three years I still never met you because you said you never leave your apartment I don’t I don’t go out the house much these days either Um it’s really amazing to meet you in person I appreciate you coming on The Last Time Pandemic Times doing it [00:27:00] on Zoom Obviously I’ve actually watched you quite a lot on the Best of a Food Review Show I knew you weren’t Sonny’s wife It wasn’t me Googling that That was really funny I couldn’t believe that when I saw that in my set It’s like this is why people searching your website I’ll get a screenshot and I’ll send it to you I’ll put it up right here so people can see

yeah yeah Um and tell people now where can they find you because you are a Food Influencer Food and Beverage K O L which I had to Google that phrase recently as well

Thuyen: K-O-L-K-O-L. Oh,

Niall: Opinion Leader

Which is basically a fancy term for an influencer right

I think

Thuyen: right?

Marketing

Niall: people were like we can’t call them influencers we need a fancy acronym

so it’s K O L

Thuyen: Um

Niall: where can people Oh

Thuyen: Um, but yeah, thank you so much for having me again. Uh, like I told you before, you know, when you were setting things up that I don’t really do a lot of interviews [00:28:00] anymore.

I don’t go to events anymore because I’ve been dedicated my time to study. Yeah. I’m studying German as well, by the way.

So

Niall: last time three years ago

Thuyen: yeah,

yeah

And then now

should be fluent

Niall: by now

Thuyen: Oh, I hope so. I’m having a test coming. Um, yeah, but, um, I think, um, yeah, great, great time to be here. You know, I’m so happy to see you in person. I think I do much better when I see you in person.

I don’t do well with pandemic. Um, yeah, but what did you ask me

again? ADHD. ADHD

Um

it is. Um, I’m very active on my Instagram at Thuyen Vo, 1, 2. Yeah, so please put it

Niall: There was 11 other there and you were the

Thuyen: Oh yes, yes,

Niall: How

Thuyen: do you know that? I, I messaged her. I was like, can you give it to me? She’s like,

Niall: No way which number Number

Thuyen: no .

Niall: Toyinvaa

Thuyen: Somebody

Niall: Oh

Thuyen: Yeah, with no number. And [00:29:00] I was shooting for that, and she was like, uh, no. How about no. So yeah, I went with one two, which is my birthday date. Yeah, um, and then I’m also on Facebook. Yeah, which is Thuyen Vo, no one too. And um, I have TikTok as well as Thuyen Vo as well, which is getting boring.

And you can find me on LinkedIn. Actually, um, Jovo is the one that got me there, because I was not very, uh, you know, active. Yeah. And then I saw her post about, you know, how she got in touch with a lot of like minded people on LinkedIn and I started posting more and yes, it’s great.

just started using LinkedIn

Niall: for

my

Thuyen: business

Niall: like two months ago and a whole different

Thuyen: exactly.

Niall: like why am I wasting time on Facebook I want to grow my business get on LinkedIn

Thuyen: exactly. So yeah. If, if any other influencers, I hope you check that out

It’s great. Yeah. And that’s where you find me. Hopefully YouTube one day, not yet.

Niall: Well we’re [00:30:00] going to talk about that

after

Well thank you very much for listening to this episode of a Vietnam podcast It’s really exciting to be back for season 10 If anyone’s a regular listener I stopped for almost two years making any episodes I lost a lot of the passion a lot of the energy and enthusiasm for it for it I really wasn’t I stopped making because I wasn’t enjoying it really

Thuyen: Um

feel

Niall: I’ve got the energy back and I’m really excited to talk to people and share episodes again So thank you so much for listening Thank you for coming on The best thing you can do if you enjoy this episode please send it to someone else Please share it Let other people know about this podcast Whether you’re visiting Vietnam you live here or you want to come send me a message get in touch Obviously do all that things that people always say share subscribe like all of that stuff I hate saying it but I feel like you have to do

Thuyen: yeah You have

Niall: to right I hate you have to say it Yeah

Thuyen: It’s little

Niall: little reminder Have you ever done it I don’t think I’ve ever turned on the notifications and subscribed because somebody told me to I’ve only ever done it because I wanted to

I’m telling [00:31:00] you go do it Thank you very much Cheers